jain girl and the pic

KK: A jain girl was looking at nude photos of her boyfriend
KK: Mom walks in
KK: Sees the pic
KK: Beti yeh kya Kar rahi hai
KK: Naye guru aye hain maa
KK: Accha
KK: Jai jinendra😂😂😂

(I also heard that the jainas have tantra-s for accomplishing mAraNAdi-karmas. So much for their theory :-) )


दम्पतिभ्यां क्रियमाणय् औपासने सौन्दर्यम् किञ्चित्

अधुनैवास्याम् अमावास्यायाम् स्थालीपाकः कृतः। ततः प्राङ् मन्मनस्य् अस्फुरीद् इदम् सौन्दर्यम् औपासनहोमस्य सन्ध्योपासने सवितुः कृपया –

  • विवाहस्य साक्षी यो ऽग्निः, *स एव* विवाह-साक्षी भवति खलु दम्पत्योर् नित्यम् उपास्यः!
  • तेन विवाहे गृहस्थाश्रमे सर्वाश्रमोत्तमे च श्रद्धा वर्धते, तयोस् सामरस्यञ्च। विशिष्य यदि दम्पती स्मरतो विस्मयेन सौन्दर्यांशम् इदम्।
  • अहो! विस्मयावह आर्याणाम् इयं व्यवस्था गृहस्थगृहसमृद्धिपोषणाय!

आस्ताम्। गृहस्थैर् आर्यैर् इमानि कर्माण्य् अवश्यं कार्याणि सरलानि –

  • नित्यम् औपासनम्।
  • नित्यम् वैश्वदेवम् – दैव-ऋषि-पितृ-मानुष-भूत-ऋण-स्मरणार्थम्।
  • पर्वसु स्थालीपाकः। ततो निर्दिष्टदिनेष्व् आग्रायणम्, ईशानबलिः, सर्पबलयश् च।

हन्त! केचित्तु मतिनाशेनाऽनावश्यकाग्रहान् कुर्वन्त्य् उत्तमस्यास्य प्रकल्पस्यार्षस्य द्विजेषु प्रसारम् अवरोद्धुम्। देव वैकुण्ठवासिन् लक्ष्मीरमण – सद्बुद्धिं वितर।

Some small snippets of good rumour.

1 Hindu right wingers getting into army and IAS in greater numbers. Earlier they would be deliberately failed, now due to the low pay and such the army mostly attracts genuinely service minded people (ie the right hindu demographic).
2 haryANvI jAT-s, in small numbers, import bAnglAdeshi brides, and jATifying (implies also hinduifying) them solidly. (Unforseen effect of sex ratio imbalance.) Price under a lakh.
3 A famous hindu televangelist’s son, who had fallen in “love” with an ROP girl, is now back in the “fold” after his “love” chose to take the money and leave him. (Conflicting reports about this.)

appayya and the stationary earth

The below was related by a friend:

As per shruti earth is stationary [TW]
Appayya as a firm believer of shruti argued it must be true
Bhattathiri asked whether moon is closer to earth or the stars
Obviously moon
From astronomical tables it is known certain stars rise earlier than moon
Bhattathiri’s argument is how come a far away object can have shorter period
It is logical absurdity and appayya was summarily beaten
Bhattathiri was a great astronomer  Not many know it.. They just end with nArAyaNIyam and at most his paada saptati

The svayameva mRgendrataa fraud.

The RSS / HSS motto “स्वयमेव मृगेन्द्रता” (~ supremacy by one’s own merits) comes from a beautiful subhAShita – “नाभिषेको न संस्कारः सिंहस्य क्रियते वने । विक्रमार्जितसत्त्वस्य स्वयमेव मृगेंद्रता ॥ “. You see it on some of their shirts etc..
But, in actual fact, nothing could be farther than the truth. Far from producing mRgendra-s, they seem to be good at turning everyone to (fairly timid) sheeple. They are like good ants at best. While they are a fair place to make friends and develop a support network, it is the idiot who will expect his or her talents to bloom for the good of the dharma in “the sangh”. People not interested in mediocrity and stupefied conformity will not fit in.
From my observation of them, it’s more like: “पिपीलिका वयं सर्वे सङ्घे शक्तिः कलौ युगे। स्वयमेव मृगेन्द्रत्वं स्वप्नेऽपि नैव रोचते॥”


The ensuing conversation has led me to deduce that perhaps the main (limited) remaining value of the RSS is to produce svayamsevaka-s like kRShNashAstri, prachAraka-s who get loaned to various mission-specific organizations etc.. Perhaps their work is what mRgendratA in the logo might be alluding to. But, is it the most efficient way of doing so? Is the cost too high? I am not sure.

Barring such gems, I still suspect that most people get sucked into a lot of time-pass in the guise of actual service to the dharma, and that this is overall detrimental.


Related thread 1:

SS:: Not sure what your problem is with RSS. Maybe their system doesn’t appeal to you, but it is undeniable that they have done and are doing much service to the nation and at grassroots level lots of mice are at least given backbone (if not turned into lions or tigers) due to participation in RSS. IMO FWIW Hindutva would certainly be in a worse position without RSS.
नापसंद · जवाब दें · 6 · 20 घंटे
VV:: RSS has made (and continues to make) great contributions to the hindu society – no denying that. But at what cost? (And *everything* has a cost.)In other words, I am not sure if we would be in a worse position without RSS. All that talent and frustration lulled into a false sense of security and accomplishment might have been doing something bolder and more worthwhile.
पसंद · जवाब दें · 16 घंटे · संपादित

SS:: RSS doesn’t ask you to resign from Google to be a svayamsevak. My father (a doctor) was jillaa bauddhik pramukh for quite some time. His cousin was a practising advocate in Chennai (now a High Court judge) and served as nagar kaaryavaah. These people …और देखें
पसंद · जवाब दें · 14 घंटे · संपादित
VV:: “RSS doesn’t ask you to resign from Google to be a svayamsevak. My father (a doctor) was jillaa bauddhik pramukh for quite some time. His cousin was a practising advocate in Chennai (now a High Court judge) and served as nagar kaaryavaah. These people didn’t (and don’t) waste their talent. Only a small fraction of svayamsevaks are full-time and most of their talent is to be social workers. ” -> I am not saying that not being a doctor or engineer or lawyer despite qualifications and talent in that area is the cost of RSS. Having gone to a few shAkhA-s and met quite a few prachArak-s I am aware that is not the case. The cost is something else.

Let me put it like this: What if all these people joined and contributed to some other organization in their free time? Suppose RSS was not there, what would they be doing? Say Hindu Munnaani or HMK or some mission specific group such as samskrita bhaaratii or that group of tamiL lawyers which specializes in litigating against the sickular government to fight misappropriation of temple property? Does being a svayamsevaka or a “jillaa bauddhik pramukh” or “nagar kaaryavaah” (with all their endless bhaiTak-s) fill one with misplaced satisfaction? To what extant does service to the organization translate into service to the society? 10:1?

“Even from the individual (rather than society) POV, RSS is like gurukula system for the masses in that it will teach you a lot of samskara-s you’d probably not learn otherwise…” – Sure, that peer-influence is to be acknowledged. But to a very limited degree for most people. (RSS schools and Ekal Vidyalaya do a good job there specially.) Lot of organizations do that – including the many baabaa-doms (real or fake).

Rather, the main benefit *was* that it provided a forum for people who cared about hindutva to get together and slightly increase the chance that they will meet someone who is as enthusiastic and bold as them about their particular projects (when one does not get frustrated by the platitude spouting mass or worse – deliberate stonewalling by the pipiilikaa-s). But that is more or less obviated by social media and meetup’s in this age.
पसंद · जवाब दें · 6 घंटे

VV:: Not to mention the (obvious) serious cost of being a prachaarak – almost always no gRhasthAshrama right when staunch hindu progeny is needed the most.
पसंद · जवाब दें · 5 घंटे


Related thread 2:

(Comments by one of the correspondents, Nihar, were deleted by him before they could be archived. However, relevant sections are quoted.)


PC:: Are you sure it is the motto of RSS also?
Also, perhaps they are the same idiots (who expected their talents to bloom for the good of the dharma in “the sangh”) who started organizations like Samskrita Bharati, BJP and hundreds others.
Perhaps you meant to point out the “mellow-ness” rather than “mediocrity and stupefied conformity”?
नापसंद · जवाब दें · 2 · 20 घंटे

VV:: In response to the first question: No, Pratik. Emblem may be? Or popular catch phrase? Whatever it may be, it is a way of lulling svayamsevak-s into thinking they are part of some shivAji’s army.

“Also, perhaps they are the same idiots (who expected their talents to bloom for the good of the dharma in “the sangh”) who started organizations like Samskrita Bharati, BJP and hundreds others.” – Note that this did not and cannot happen with the RSS. They had to seek out and collaborate with *many* non-RSS people.

“Perhaps you meant to point out the “mellow-ness” rather than “mediocrity and stupefied conformity”?” -> Definitely the latter. It is based on personal observations which I will not elaborate on for fear of offending people further other than to note a pervasive assertive self-assured groupthink.
पसंद · जवाब दें · 1 · 16 घंटे

VV:: “” Note that this did not and cannot happen with the RSS. They had to seek out and collaborate with *many* non-RSS people.” – have you talked to Krishnasastry ji to see if this theory of yours holds any water? Do you even have anecdotal evidence to corroborate this?” —->
Absolutely – anecdotal evidence. shrI kRShNashAstri is not the kind to give a striaght answer to such pointed questions, but that is in fact the case. (Udayana or Venkatesh Murthy, who have a lot of background may please correct me by providing contrary information.)
First to summarize how exactly RSS helped foster sanskrita bhAratI (by which I include its earlier 1981-birthed life as the Sanskrit wing of the Hindu Seva Pratishthanam).
* It is quite conceivable that the spirit of popular activism (reminiscent of HSS/ RSS sampark) that inspired kRShNashAstrI likely came from RSS (not that it would not have otherwise come from elsewhere). Some part of the organizational template (heavy dependence on volunteers for example) likely comes from RSS.
* The specific goal of sanskrit popularization came from his conversation with a senior RSS person. This is a personal influence, not an organizational influence.
* RSS provides and provided ready access to people who accomodate samskrita bhAratI people in their travels as part of their mission.
That’s it. RSS more or less is non committal (as usual) about sanskrit (or even Indian language) revival. No change in shAkhA format, no urging the svayamsevak-s to learn some sanskrit etc.. So, just focus on what *unique* things has RSS given in summary? The general volunteer-based activism template is the main contribution. Infrastructure (contacts and short term accommodation) support comes next. Even there, would these NOT have been available were it not for RSS? I daresay no. RSS is not the best (or only) template for volunteer based popular activism. It’s an old and persistent feature of Hindu samAja.
You have yourself acknowledged that they needed to collaborate with “new” people. Very true – this was essential. To reiterate this point – mahAbaleshvara bhaTTa? not from RSS. janArdhana hegde? not from RSS. HR Vishwas? Not from RSS.

“I see that lot of activists want to blame Sangh for “mediocrity”. Well I see that most Hindu activists (more so outside Sangh) are mediocre.” —> I must reiterate that this mediocrity is not central, but is a consequence of my main point of stupefaction and “opportunity cost” of the RSS (more below). It does not do to focus on the branches rather than the trunk.

“But Sangh of course is a easy punching bag.” —> It is not only an easy punching bag, but it ***has*** to be the primary punching bag, as it is forms the bulk of hindu activism today. The elephant cannot complain that birds around it aren’t getting as much (negative) attention.

The most important point is that: RSS is doing something right – it has ensured it’s own survival and propagation. But at the expense of other more potent modes of activism. Take this analogy: MK Gandhi’s popular movement reduced the attractiveness (by a great degree) of other modes of hindu activism (like RSS). In the very same way, RSS is having a definite negative effect on the growth of even firmer and better grounded modes of hindu activism.

It is like sticking lollypop into the mouths of a lot of people who actually want laDDu-s.

An ancilliary point is this:
Generally organizations with a specific goal (Ekal, Samskrita bhAratI, yoga-bhAratI, Art of Living etc..) accomplish far more than organizations with a vaguer and broader agenda (eg: RSS). The latter class, overall, diminishes interest in and competes with the former class.
पसंद · जवाब दें · 2 घंटे

VV:: And, to respond to ” You try to present it as if these people had to leave the fold of Sangh and get converted out of it (like a Christian conversion) to do all of that.” –
it is very much the case that they “leave” the RSS behind. How frequently do people heavily involved in these other organizations get the time or (more to the point) inclination to attend shAkhA or meetings? More often than not, they’ll be like “bah. whatever. I want to get real stuff done.”
पसंद · जवाब दें · 1 घंटा

VV:: Nihara, you are welcome to take my words seriously or not. I believe I’ve already done due diligence with regards to what I’ve stated here, but am happy to revise my understanding if new facts point otherwise.

(And, the last part of your response is an example of “argumentum ad homineim” http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/person.html, and is worthy of being disregarded. It is not very important if people are pissed off with HSS and its prominent defenders for whatever reason including but not limited to lack of basic courtesy.)
Argumentum Ad Hominem
The argument concerning the attack of a person’s character or circumstances is characterized and shown to be sometimes persuasive but normally fallacious.
पसंद · जवाब दें · समीक्षा को हटाएं · 44 मिनट · संपादित

VV:: That said, I would be remiss in not pointing out the “beat the nail that sticks out” attitude in the RSS/ HSS quoting your very words “while being pathetic and eccentric themselves”. This is exactly the kind of stupefaction that I speak about, where eccentricity is considered negative. मृगेन्द्रता my ass.

Further points from shrI Nihar:

Krishnashatry ji himself told this when he met us last time in Bay Area. Ask him why he goes to shakha. There might be something he thinks is important that you might be missing.

One more fact: Dinesh Kamat ji – a senior prachark was given to Sanskrit Bharati if you didn;t know that. He was Sanghatan mantri last I checked and was instrumental in many of the new initiatives of Sanskrit Bharati.

Suresh ji in Bangalore also was given to Sanskrit Bharati in Karnataka and last I heard he has returned to HSP after many years there. These are only a few examples, I am sure there are many in each state.

“K Suryanarayanrao ji, one of the senior most pracharaks was the president of Samskruta Bharati for a very long time while he still was Akhila Bharatiya Sewa Pramukh in RSS. I am indeed surprised you didn’t know any of that.”

Japanese blood-debt and other Hindu connections

Consider this article (via rjrasva@). There are several interesting aspects to it.


Japan paid the blood-price

It is heartening to note the below excerpt:
“Many of the Shinto association’s aims overlap with those of another increasingly influential group, Nippon Kaigi (Japan Conference), whose 38,000 members, including Abe and most of his cabinet, believe that Japan “liberated” Asia from Western colonial powers, and that the postwar constitution has emasculated the country’s “true, original characteristics”.
Yes, Japan “liberated” Asia, including India. The British would not have left but for the enormous blood price paid by our Japanese brothers. It is a pity that most Hindu-s do not understand this. Here, it is gratifying to note that this is not a mere figment of our (ie. Japan admiring Hindu) imagination – it is also the self image of the Shinto elite. My deepest respects to them 🙏🙏🙏.

Ancilliary matters

* To be fully liberated, the sage of MT says that it is almost certain that Hindu-s will have to pay a similarly enormous price. It is a different matter as to whether we are already dead and it’s just the corpse that is rotting.

Indologist – Japanologist similitude

Analogous to White “hindu-s” lecturing to us about what “hinduism really is, and how hindutva is not hinduism”, this John guy fancies that his “green shiNTo” is the shiNTo, and that the old shiNTo of the natives is evil.

Furthermore, it quotes:
Koichi Nakano, a politics professor at Sophia University in Tokyo. “I already felt rather uncomfortable when Barack Obama was taken to Meiji Shrine last time he visited Japan, and it would be no less disturbing to see the G7 leaders being used to legitimise Shinto, given its reactionary and nationalistic positions on so many issues.”
This guys is an example of a first class traitor. A friend rightly notes: “i suspect this Koichi Nakano to be a preta or a leftist, sophia university is a catholic uni”. The analogy with Indian sickulars is too obvious to note explicitly.

An expoit of raghuvIra

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghu_Vira was a great scholar. Reading the below, it is no wonder that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lokesh_Chandra is his son.


=====================Begin excerpt===============
Do you know raghuvira’s story
He was in pre partition TSP
Tsp ?
Terrorist state of porkistan
He knew population exchange was coming. So he sent all his family to mainland bharat ahead of time
They had land and property
He didn’t want to abandon those just like that
So wanted to see which direction wind blew
He stockpiled weapons. Rifles, pistols
Oh.. !!
So the indologist raghuvira had a James Bond in him
Sullas came to his neighborhood
But didn’t expect he was prepared
Before abandoning his property for good, he wanted to inflict as much damage as possible
His house got surrounded
He loaded up with pistols and rifles, escaped from the house
Shot his way through the border and escaped to india
I’m only grateful for his editorial work of jaiminiya brahmana
For this heroic deed, he is my personal hero

कुतः संस्कृतस्य प्रभुत्वम्? Whence Sanskrit’s supremacy?


सङ्क्षेपेण वक्तव्यं चेद् एवं मन्यमानैर् ब्राह्मणप्रधानैर् दक्षैर् भाषाशिक्षकैस् तद्रक्षणं प्रचारश्च –

  • “वेदोऽखिलो धर्ममूलम्।” इत्यादिः।
  • वेदादीनां रक्षा, पोषणञ्च संस्कृतेनेति- “भाषां वाऽपि जनं वाऽपि धर्मो रक्षिति रक्षितः।”
  • संस्कारेणार्ष-मार्ग-ग्रहणं श्रेयस इति। तत्र पद्यम् अत्र, अधश् च-
चलनाद् वलनान् नृत्यं गानं
क्वणनाद् वचनात् काव्यं यस्मात्।
संस्कार त्वं लीलायुक्तस्
स्थेया व्याप्तस् सर्वस्वे मे॥

“Sanskrit as a supreme language” by Ashok Aklujkar [Arch] is a very pertinent read. Some excerpts follow, with some added formatting. My notes are marked in bold like this: (KV: … ). The most important section is the one titled: “Emergence of dominance”.

Phases of Sanskrit

Of the long time span I keep in view, the following would be the major divisions, if
one were to follow the vicissitudes of Sanskrit as they have generally
been seen in the scholarship on the subject:

(a) the period of Early Vedic represented by most of the Rg-veda, some
parts of the Atharva-veda and many of the scattered res preserved in
other Vedic texts, to which the appellation Vedic Sanskrit most fit-
tingly applies and in which explicit recognition of any known language
other than the language of the texts is yet to be detected; 11

(b) the period of much of the Atharva-veda, the Yajur-veda sariihitas, the early Brahmanas (including the Aranyakas and Early Upanisads) in which we have the immediate predecessor of most of Sanskrit proper and in which a recognition of the existence of other languages is found, but again, as in the Rg-veda, without any specific names (see note 11);

(c) the period of the Middle Upanisads, early sutra and Vedanga texts in
which Sanskrit proper has almost fully emerged and the separation of
contemporary Sanskrit from Vedic Sanskrit is either clearly presup-
posed or openly acknowledged;

(d) probably largely overlapping with the preceding, the period of
early Epic or Puranic Sanskrit (much of which is accessible to us only
in a form mingled with the later Epic or Puranic Sanskrit) and of
Sramanic movements and the early phases of Jainism and Buddhism, in
which languages related to but different from early Sanskrit exist and
are used for literary and religio-philosophical purposes;

(e) the period of Sanskrit proper co-existing with Epic or Puranic San-
skrit, Buddhist Hybrid Sanskrit and possibly other vernacular varieties,
in which Sanskrit has largely ceased to be a language of all-purpose
communication, in which the competing canonical languages, Pali and
Ardha-magadhI, are probably undergoing the same fate, in which all
three languages, but especially Sanskrit, have many centres of study
even in South India, and in which Sanskrit and Pali begin to establish
their presence in East and Southeast Asia; and

(f) the period of classical Sanskrit, in which the language almost always
conforms to the model provided by Paninian grammar, in which even
the Buddhists and the Jainas switch to the use of Sanskrit (without giv-
ing up the use of other dialects and languages) for serious religio-philo-
sophical purposes, and in which Sanskrit is used for the pan-Indian
content of practically all the sastras.

Important observations

We should, I believe, admit the following elements as obtaining in the periods concerned:

Element 1: Efforts were made to ensure that Sanskrit remained nearer
to the language of the Veda. 16 The sustained proximity helped it reap
the benefits of the prestige that went with the Veda. A tradition of
seeking association with the Veda for respectability had come into ex-
istence at a much earlier date than historians of ancient Indian culture
have so far observed. Even the Buddhists and the Jainas, contrary to the
perception prevalent at present, have extended the ‘tipping of the hat’
type of acknowledgement to the Veda in the ancient periods of their

Element 2: … This prestige-bestowing development seems to have taken place in
the following stages:

  • (a) the rise of the concept of a Speech or Language
    Principle (viz., the very basic undifferentiated language which lies at
    the root of all individual languages including those of nonhuman
    beings) as a mark of living beings — as something invested in them by
    God or gods, as divine;
  • (b) identification of the essence or original
    form of the Veda corpus with the Language Principle and of the Veda
    corpus itself with the closest possible realisation of the Language Prin-
  • (c) thinking of the linguistic expression that the Veda corpus is as
    divine by a sort of ‘next of kin’ logic;
  • (d) seeing Sanskrit as continua- tion of the Vedic linguistic expression;
  • (e) transfer of the epithet ‘divine’ to Sanskrit.

Element 3: The disinclination to separate Sanskrit from the Lan-
guage Principle and, what we would call, Vedic Sanskrit is matched, at
the other end, by the disinclination, on the part of authors of early San-
skrit linguistic works, to indicate that, when they discuss what seem to
be Prakrit 22 words to us, they have in mind languages related to Sanskrit
but different from it. Their assumption appears to be that of a linguistic
continuum, extending from what we call Sanskrit to what we call
Prakrit. 23 Nowhere does one get the sense that they felt any urgency to
isolate Sanskrit as a language (see note 18). The capacity for absorbing
deviation thus accorded to Sanskrit must have helped it in not being in
open competition with other ‘languages’. 24 The high linguistic ground
it took must have meant that it had a long time to march ahead without
other languages coming in its way.

Element 4: The key expressions employed in stating or implying
the higher standing of what we call Sanskrit are sam + kr and its deriva-
tives. Not only is Samskrta claimed to have undergone samskara, the
other languages are given a relatively low ranking in its favour because
they lack samskara (Deshpande 1979a: 22).
(KV: What is samskAra? See below:)

  • Now, at least from the days of Yaska, the Nirukta author, one com-
    ponent of the meaning of saiiiskara is clear: ‘subjecting to, or being
    amenable to, or undergoing grammatical operation, having gram-
    matical perspicuity’.
  • One additional constituent must be proper pronunciation, etc. That
    there was value attached to good qualities of speech in ancient India is
    abundantly clear from, among other pieces of evidence, certain adjec-
    tives employed in Vedic literature and the way the Buddha’s speech is
    described. 29 If a certain kind of extra-mundane efficacy was associated
    with accurate and good pronunciation, then the presence of this type of
    samskara would be even more valued.
  • Beyond this, a connotation must have existed to the effect that to be
    careful in speech — to attempt to use a language with samskara — is to
    observe a certain discipline of the mind and body and that a person’s
    subscribing to such a discipline is an indication of his good spiritual
    standing. The passage yas tu prayunkte kusalo vis’ese sabdan yathavad
    vyavahara-kale so ’ nantam apnoti jayam paratra, cited by Patanjali and
    referred to in the preceding paragraph, would not make sense if such a
    connotation is not assumed. The most explicit evidence is furnished,
    however, by the passages like Kalidasa’s samskaravatyeva gira manlsi
    taya [= Parvatya] sa putas ca vibhusitas ca (Kumara-sambhava 1 .28)
    and Bhartr-hari’s tasmad yah sabda-samskarah sa siddhih paramat-
    manah / . . . vya vasthi ta-sadh u – bhavena hi rupena samskriyamane
    sabda-tattve ’pabhramsopaghatapagamad avir-bhute dharma-visese
    niyato ’bhyudayah (Trikandl 1.144, Vrtti (YP I): pp. 201-02) and
    sadhvi vag bhuyasi yesu purusesu vyavasthita / adhikam vartate tesu
    punyam ruparii praja-pateh //(Vrtti 1.124-28 = karika 1.126).
  • One last association of samskara, which has not been pointed out so
    far in the research literature known to me, is with a highly pervasive
    principle of Vedic or Brahmanical thinking: To use a thing with
    knowledge of its genesis is superior to simply using it. Use must be, as
    far as possible, backed up by information about its ‘how’s and
    ‘why’s — the ya evam veda sa veda principle articulated in a number of
    Brahmana and Upanisad texts. A sastra-purvaka prayoga is preferable
    to a mere prayoga. The employment of a nonstandard linguistic form
    may not generate demerit, but it does not generate merit either. The ca-
    pacity to achieve that exists only in a samskrta or standard form, since
    its user, given the social realities of his time, will, in most cases, be an
    educated person and as such will know how the form came to be what it
    is or why it must have certain features.

Element 5: For most of the specified time-span, a religious life
which was a significantly different mixture of organized and unor-
ganized religion from the one we nowadays normally imagine for that
time-span prevailed. The well-demarcated religious thinking and
living which the text-based Indological discussion of the three major
religions of ancient India — of Brahmanism, Jainism and Bud-
dhism — usually presupposes was true only of relatively few individu-
als. While the three religions were not entirely unorganized, were not
unconscious of the need to preserve their identities, and must have
made efforts to propagate themselves, the average Indian lived a life
that did not belong exclusively to (what we would call) one religious
line of thinking. He took what can be described as a grocery cart ap-
proach. Even while following one teaching principally, he did not, in
all likelihood, shun the holy men of other religions 34 or avoid com-
pletely the practices supposed to belong to another (in our terminology,
religious) stratum — practices such as propitiating a local Yaksa or
making a donation to a local monument belonging to a heterodox
religion if his prayer was answered.

Emergence of dominance

My argument suggests that, during the periods (c) – (f) mentioned
in section 2.2, it is not the political or economic backing which Sanskrit
received that is as important for its spread and high standing as the
culture, particularly the religious culture, in which Sanskrit found it-
self (and which it nurtured in return). …
The rulers and the state resources largely seem to have acted only as fa-
cilitators of a cultural process.
(Footnote: The spread of Pali and Ardha-magadhi also seems to have come about essentially in the same way as the one delineated in this paragraph.)

The phenomenon of the pre-eminence of Sanskrit, to clarify my
view further, became possible positively, because, at the time of its

  • (a) the notion of the Veda as a text on which to base philo-
    sophical, social and political thinking, even if that thinking in fact hap-
    pened to be new, had won wide acceptance,
  • (b) the institution of at-
    taching some kind of special power and sanctity to the Veda sound had
    already come into effect, (KV: Recall vedic prayoga-s)
  • (c) the followers of the Vedic way of life had
    already instituted certain educational mechanisms to maintain the pu-
    rity of their language, and
  • (d) the society had become accustomed to
    attaching value to knowledgeable, correct and clear speech as a mark of
    ennobling discipline and self-restraint.

The phenomenon became possible, negatively, that is, was not op-
posed effectively,

  • (a) because a religious life not tending to be exclu-
    sivistic generally predominated,
  • (b) because at least some socially in-
    fluential thinkers saw some benefit in not explicating everything, that
    is, in retaining certain myths and de-emphasizing historical divisions, 37
  • (c) because Sramanik religions like Jainism and Buddhism had
    relatively narrower philosophies — philosophies capable of drawing
    invariable commitment from only those who could be attracted to renunciation.

The processes and developments which probably helped Sanskrit
in maintaining its pre-eminence once it came into being seem to be:

  • (a) training 39 of a vast and astoundingly gifted body of suta narrators 40 who
    constituted a very effective mechanism for reaching practically all
    levels of society,
  • (b) creation of an educational network that seems un-
    paralleled in the ancient world, 41
  • (c) development, mostly as a result of (b), of literature on practically all aspects of (ancient and medieval) life, and
  • (d) constant cultivation of a class that mesmerized the ordinary
    man through its intellectual and linguistic achievements.

The foregoing thoughts should not be viewed as excluding causes
such as Brahmin-Ksatriya collaboration, utility as a language of re-
ligious life, usefulness as a link language, 44 advantages a frozen lan-
guage has, 45 refusal to degrade the language by allowing its use for low-
level vyavahara (KV: Strongly disagree), repeated efforts to Sanskritize, etc .
46 Some of them are
subsumed by the elements I have noted. Others are applicable only to
the times in which Sanskrit had already assumed a leading role.


“मोहल्ला अस्सि”, आत्मविस्मृतिः

“मोहल्ला अस्सि” नामकं चलच्चित्रं दृष्टम्। अन्तरङ्गे क्षोभ उद्भवत्य् अस्माकं स्थितिं चिन्तयित्वा।

क्षात्रे धर्मभ्रंशः (म्लेच्छशासनम्,भूहरणम्, आङ्ग्लपूरणम्, मूर्खप्रजाप्रभुत्वम्, अतिशयारक्षणम्, सद्ब्राह्मणासमर्थनम्) → दारिद्र्यम् (विशिष्य भारतीयसंस्कृतेर् अध्येतृषु), लोभोऽपि कश्चित् → विक्रयणम् → आत्मविस्मृतिर् व्यापिनी → जुगुप्सा क्वचित् → कामेनार्थेन च साकम् भारतीय-सत्त्वस्य रक्षणम् तैः।

“Based on Dr. Kashinath Singh’s Hindi novel ‘Kashi Ka Assi’, a religious satire based on the commercialization of the pilgrimage city, and fake gurus who lure the visitors and tourists.”

मुख्यपात्राणि – कश्चित् पाण्डेयविद्वान् साम्प्रदायिकः तत्पत्नी च, तत्प्रलुब्ध-परिवेषि-ब्रह्मबन्धवः, कश्चिद् भ्रष्टब्राह्मणो हिन्दिसाहित्यविद्वान् यो विदेशिप्रेक्षकान् नयति, कश्चिन् नापितश् चतुरः कामुकश्च यस् स्वबुद्धिप्रभावेन श्वेतस्त्रीं परिणीय योगगुरुर् जायते, कामातुरा श्वेतजनाः येषु केचनाध्यात्मजिज्ञासवोऽपि। मुख्यस्थानानि – गङ्गातीरे पुरोहितानाम् उपवेशनस्थानम्, चायविपणी यत्र नानाचर्चाः प्रवर्तन्ते, संस्कृतपाठशाला, श्वेतत्वग्भ्यो दत्तानि प्रकोष्ठानि।

“Prior to its release Mohalla Assi leaked online on 11 August 2015. The film has been banned by the CBFC on 8th April 2016.”

सम्पूर्णस्य चित्रस्य सङ्केतः – अत्र



Guan Yu: Pagan reverence of anything awesome


I went to a smog test shop, but had forgotten my wallet. There I noted an obviously cared for statue of Guan Yu, a chinese deity, who I later learned to be:

  • Essentially a deified very loyal and honorable general from 2k years back.
  • An equivalent of mitra or varuNa, in his care for righteousness.
  • Highly revered by business folk.
  • Revered even by even mongols and manchus.
  • Accepted by multiple streams of chinese reverence (made a buddhist guardian by a zen master according to one tradition, a Taoist deity, etc..)

This process of deification of extraordinary mortals is quite concordant to my hindu self which daily adores its pitR-s/ ancestors and historical heroes (esp. shivAjI, hammIra and rAjasimha) through rites and mantra-s. But, I had not found an adequate expression of this phenomenon in hindu thought, until I read Dr. G L Krishna’s appendix E here.

kRShNa says in the bhagavad-gItA : “यद्यद्विभूतिमत्सत्त्वं श्रीमदूर्जितमेव वा । तत्तदेवावगच्छ त्वं मम तेजोंऽशसम्भवम् ॥ ४१ ॥” – “All that is endowed with glory, grace, grandeur, has sprung from a mere flare of my radiance”

  • To paraphrase GL kRShNa: The adoration of awesomeness includes adoration of glorious characters in our legends, the celebration of natural geography (the great rivers, the great mountains, etc. as centres of pilgrimage) and the adoration of sages (from Vyasa-Vishwamitra to Ramana-Ramakrishna).

The benefits of this are obvious, and I’ve considered them in detail elsewhere. But it reminds me of the sage of mAnasatarangiNI quoting socrates, and rjrasva@ quoting a bAlinese hindu on the topic:

  • Socrates on the use of myth here: “I accept what is customarily believed concerning them, and, as I was saying, I look not into them but into my own self: Am I a beast more complicated and savage than Typhon, or am I a tamer, simpler animal with a share in a divine and gentle nature?”.
  • In this conversation between a bAlinese hindu and a German christian about the historicity of rAMa, the pestered hindu asks: “Do you want to know whether the story is true, or merely whether it occurred?” [Orientalism and Religion: Post-Colonial Theory, India and “The Mystic East” By Richard King, pp. 39-40].
  • The high priest of Ásatrúarfélagið, the norse temple : “I don’t believe anyone believes in a one-eyed man who is riding about on a horse with eight feet,” Hilmar Örn Hilmarsson, told Reuters. “We see the stories as poetic metaphors and a manifestation of the forces of nature and human psychology.” … The priest said the gods are viewed as mystical and symbolic. Most modern worshipers don’t consider them to be living beings that are capable of flying down from the clouds. … The Asatru religion might describe itself as poetic–but if some Christians, especially those in the Western hemisphere, were to take a literal look at the new altar to pagan gods they might consider it satanic. (DailyBeast)

Well, Guan Yu/ varuNa was kind to me that day – the Hispanic tech (who identified the statue upon asking) allowed me to take my car home and return with my wallet.


The “mlecCha > dalit” stupidity.

One aspect where the jAti-system was completely rotten – especially in the madhouse of keraLa, where a low-jAti person converted to a muslim or christian would be treated much better. This contributed to their increase in numbers. Enjoy the fruits of your forefathers, you keraLa hindus! अश्वं नैव गजं नैव व्याघ्रं नैव च नैव च | अजापुत्रं बलिं दद्याद्देवो दुर्बलघातक: || applies to these idiots as well.

From The Three Voyages of Vasco de Gama, and His Viceroyalty. (via SP on FB)

  • “…they were more influential and respected than the natives themselves so that many of the heathen became Moors in such manner that they were more people than the natives by a diabolical method which the Moors found l because in this region of Malabar the race of gentlemen is called Nairs who are the people of war they are people who are very refined in blood and customs and separated from all other low people and so much do they value themselves that no one of them ever turned Moor only the low people turned Moors who worked in the bush and in the fields And these people are so accursed that they cannot go by any road without shouting so that the Nairs may not come up suddenly and meet them because they kill them at once for they always carry their arms and these low people may not carry arms to defend themselves and when they go along thus shouting if any Nair shouts to them they at once get into the bush very far from the road The Moors understanding that it was a good way to increase their sect said to the King and to the rulers of the places in which they traded that they met with great difficulties with their merchandise because they had not got labourers to cart it from one point to another because the labourers being low people could not go amongst other people as the Nairs would kill them whenever they met them and therefore they would esteem it a favour if those of the low people who might turn Moors should be able to go freely wherever they pleased since being Moors they would then be outside of the Malabar religion and usages and that they might be able to touch all sorts of people because if this was not agreed to they would not be able to transport their goods to sell them in their provinces At the same time giving some fees to the magistrates and confidantes of the King they succeeded in getting this consented to On which account these low people desired to enjoy so great an advantage because they were such accursed people that they lived in the bush and in fields where they ate nothing but herbs and laud crabs and by becoming Moors they could go where they liked and gain their livelihood and eat as they pleased When they became Moors the Moors gave them cloths and robes with which to clothe themselves and so many of them became Moors and were converted to the religion of Mohammed and they increased so much in numbers that all the country became full of them which caused these Moors to be very influential and powerful by their trade through all the countries and especially in this country of Malabar and above all in this city of Calecut where they had their principal “
  • “1 The diabolical method of the Moors was to set their faces against distinctions of race whilst the Portuguese adopted them and have perpetuated them by the word of their own language which expresses race namely casta.”

Another similar observation from Albuquerque a few decades later (from here):

  • “Albuquerque states this hybridization succinctly from an early modern Portuguese viewpoint: “They marry as many wives as they can support and keep as well many heathen concubines of low caste. If they have sons or daughters by these they make them Moors, and ofttimes the mother as well, and thus this evil generation continues to increase in Malabar.””

Fist of the day-wrestler.

“मुष्टिर्वासरमल्लस्य ध्वान्तवैरिविभेदनः। अदित्यश् चक्रदम्पत्योः स्नोहग्रन्थिः पुनातु वः॥”
I hear that songs get stuck in some people’s heads. I count myself lucky that verses (such as the above by Shankar) stick in mine. Because they can often be used as mantra-s.
For example, I find the above quite effective to recite, visualize and feel the power of the thousand rayed sol – just see the power in “fist of the day-wrestler trouncing the darkness-foe”. I particularly find it useful at times when the revered gAyatrI-mantra is simply not effective or appropriate (eg. – you aren’t in a mental or circumstantial position to do a proper japa).

सुशिक्षितो बालः कथं स्यात्?

इतः कश्चिद् अभिप्रायः।
गुण-ज्ञान-संयोगः कश्चिद् अपेक्षितः।
  • सद्भाव-पूर्णता
    • यान्त्रिकता-निवारणम्, सन्तोषः
    • पुरुषार्थेषु स्पष्टता
    • धर्मे निष्ठा
      • ऋणानि, यज्ञः
    • साधन-मार्गाः
      • कल्पनासूर्वरता
      • मन्त्रविद्या, ध्यानमार्गाः
      • आह्निकादिष्व् अनुष्ठानम्
  • कौशलम् बौद्धिकम्
    • सृजनात्मकता
    • प्रमाण-सङ्ग्रह-कौशलम्
      • प्रयोग-परता
      • अन्तर्जाल-प्रयोगः
    • अनुमानम् – न्याय-शास्त्राणि
      • गणितम्
    • ज्ञान-सम्पादने कौशलम्
      • प्रबन्ध-सृष्टिः
        • सारवत्त्वम्
        • सरसम्
        • विरसम्
      • शिक्षा-प्राप्तिः
        • गुरूणाम् अन्वेषणम्
    • कला-कौशल-वर्धन-पटुता
  • कौशलम् शारीरिकम्
    • आरोग्यम्
      • साधारण-रोग-निवारण-पटुता
      • व्यायामः
    • प्राकृतिक-क्रीडासु कौशलम्
      • वृक्षारोहणम्, शिलारोहणम्, पर्वतारोहणम्, हिमस्खलनम्
      • तरणम्
      • कानन-वासः
    • वाहन-चालनम्
      • द्विचक्रिकाः, चतुष्चक्रिकाः, नावः
    • सम्भोगः (विवाहात् परम्)
    • शरीर-त्यागः
  • कौशलम् सामाजिकम्
    • विनयः
      • उपचारः
    • परीक्षा
      • सूक्ष्मभावावगतिः
    • सरस-वाक्-पाटवम्
      • हास्यम्
      • ध्वनिगर्भित-भाषा-प्रयोगः
      • कूट-भाषा
    • भिन्न-लोक-परिचयः
      • भिन्न-देश-परिचयः
    • शास्त्रावलोकनम्
      • धर्मशास्त्रम्
        • भाव-प्राधान्यम्
        • परिवार-नीतिः
        • मैत्रम्
        • सामाजिक-नीतिः
        • भूत-नीतिः
      • नीतिशास्त्रम्
      • काव्यानि
    • शिक्षणे ऽनुभवः
    • कलहेष्व् अनुभवः
      • तत्रात्मनियन्त्रणम्
      • निश्शस्त्र-युद्ध-कौशलम्
      • सशस्त्र-युद्धे परिचयः
      • वाक्-कलह-पाटवम्
        • सद्-वाद-पाटवम्
        • वितण्ड-पाटवम्
    • वञ्चने ऽनुभवः
      • चौरम्
    • स्पर्धाऽनुभवः
      • क्रीडाः
    • जालक्षेत्रेषु व्यवहारः
      • अनामिकता
  • विषय-ज्ञानम्
    • भिन्न-शास्त्रेषु त्रिवर्ग-परेषु साधारणः परिचयः
      • रसिकता
        • तत्र भिन्नदर्शनानि
      • भाषा
        • भिन्न-भाषाः
        • व्याकरणम्, छन्दः
        • भाषा-सम्बन्धाः
        • काव्यम्
      • चित्र-कला
        • कागदादिषु चित्रलेखनम्
        • शिल्प-कला
          • मृत्तिकायाः
          • मृदुशिलासु
      • सङ्गीतम्
      • अभिनयः
        • कल्पः
        • नाटकम्
        • नृत्यम्
      • राजनीति-व्यवस्थाः
      • इतिहासः
        • भिन्न-प्रदेशानाम्
      • विज्ञानम्
        • आधिभौतिकम्
          • Physics, Chemistry,
          • Biology, Taxonomy
          • Economics
          • Astronomy, Geology, Hydrology
        • आध्यात्मिकम्
      • वस्तु-निर्माणम्
        • साङ्गणक-तन्त्रांश-लेखनम्
        • उपकरण-प्रयोग-पाटवम्
          • काष्ठ-वस्तु-निर्माणे
          • लोह-कार्यम्
          • पट-कार्यम्
          • 3d, 2d printing
    • रुच्य्-अनुगुणा विशेषज्ञता
    • धनार्जनाय कलाः
      • तद्-यौवन-कालस्य देशस्य चानुगुणाः स्युः

How much money to support the rest of your life?

The calculation

You can quit selling your time and toil for money and dedicate yourself to doing exactly what you want:

  • If you are able to figure out a situation where you (and your dependents) can today live with an adequate quality of life for 500$ per month (= 33000₹ in 2016) [this is just an example – plug in any number you like],
  • if you (and dependents) expect to live x years,
  • if you have accumulated 500*12x = 6000x dollars (eg. 420,000$ for 70 yrs) – or if you go by the 4% annual safe withdrawal rate logic – (6000/.04) = 150000$ (for how many ever yrs),
  • if you can grow that money at least at the rate of inflation in your place of residence
    • (by investing in fixed deposits, index funds, gold, land etc..)
  • if you are willing to either face a worse quality of life or are willing to terminate yourself if expenses rise unexpectedly high relative to resources.

What does an adequate quality of life mean to me?

  • Clean air, clean water, nutritious food, comfortable housing, comfortable clothes (suited for the place of residence)
  • health insurance
  • physical security
  • electricity, good internet connection, a tablet, smart-phone, computer, books
  • freedom to openly pursue scientific, technological and aesthetic/ spiritual interests, and benign-according-to-my-worldview advocacy (PS: this eliminates Islamic countries)
  • access to the sky, earth, trees and good people.

Additional notes:

  • This assumes, of course, that your valiant attempts at earning an adequate living doing exactly what you like have failed so far (eg: owing to family projects, rotten organizations etc.).
  • Excellent education for children up to pre-university level: Even if you need to hire people to do this, this costs at most 1-2k$ per per year = 12-24k$ total in such places per child. Ideally, by that time, the child should have adequate skills to gather money for a similar lifestyle in the economy of its time. Or it should be able to acquire such skills by its enterprise.

Alternate calculations:

  • (USA specific) 25x annual expenditure = 7% growth – 3% inflation = 4% is annual expenditure rule money mustache article.
    • This implies a 1,200,000$ savings in USA for a 4000$ monthly expenditure (as of 2016).
    • Success rate can also be estimated here: http://www.firecalc.com/
  • Silicon Valley’s FIRE movement (doing similar “geo-arbitrage”)

उत्तर-लेखने मम वर्तमान-तन्त्रम्


  • उद्देशः
    • स्पष्टता-रक्षणम्
      • लघु-चर्चासु मा भूच् च्युतिर् पाठक-लेखकयोर् अवधानोत्साहयोः।
      • अपेक्षित-बिन्दोर् उत्तरं न विस्मरेत्।
      • कस्योत्तरे किमुक्तमिति स्पष्टं स्यात्।
      • अन्यस्मै सूत्र-प्रेषणाय उचितं स्यात्।
    • त्वरा-दोष-वारणम्
      • अनुचित-भाव-प्रकाशनं मा भूत्।
      • लेखने स्खलनानि न स्युः।
  • उपायाः
    • न केवलम् अभिधावृत्तिकांशानाम् उत्तरणं स्यात्, ध्वनितांशोऽप्य् अभिज्ञायोत्तरणीयः। सारो बहुधा नोच्यते स्पष्टं प्रतिवादिभिः।
    • उत्तर-बिन्दूनि प्रामुख्य-क्रमेण स्युः।
    • मुख्यबिन्दूनि विशिष्या ऽभिज्ञाप्यन्ताम्।
    • उत्तर-बिन्दुनाम् उपरि प्राक्तनपत्रेभ्यः सम्बद्ध-वाक्यानि दर्श्यन्ताम् quoted-text-रूपेण ।
    • प्राक्प्रेषितानि पत्राण्यप्य् अनुबद्धानि स्युः
    • वाद+उपाया अन्यत्रोक्ताः – http://i.imgur.com/u0TZWVn.png


bAjIrAv’s hindu Delhi empire plan thwarted.

The below is an excerpt from ” Maratha-Rajput relations from 1720 to 1795 A.D.” (cached here) by D. Acharya which shows how bAjIrAv and the rAjaputra-s were unfortunately curtailed by shAhu cChatrapati. What a tragedy! Dammit shAhu!


Bajirao had become a national hero, in whom all hopes of safety for the Hindu religion were concentrated. The common danger had united the Rajputs completely with the Marathas as Hindus.

(iv)� � �  A Plan to Create Hindu Empire at Delhi:

Dhondo Govind (61) wrote from Delhi to Bajirao :

�Nadirshah is no God, that he could destroy the earth. He possesses sense enough and knows business. He will not break with you, but will effect a friendly understanding when he know that you are strong enough to oppose him�. I don�t expect actual hostilities to break between him and you� Jaysing and yourself aided by the Bundela Chiefs will be quite a strong Hindu front which rovidence will surely crown with success. Jaysing is anxiously waiting for your arrival to take the lead. Nizam-ul-Mulk � is playing a mischivous game. Some of his spies, found roving� about prying into Jaysing�s secret counsels, were captured by him. They confessed that they were deputed by Nizam-ul-Mulk ��all voices agree that the two nobles�. Nizam-ul-Mulk and Sadat Khan alone induced nadirshah to undertake the invasion of India�victory at this moment crowns the Peshwa alone. Many here desire that the Rana of Udaypur should be seated on the throne of Delhi and made Emperor of the Hindus. The Northern Rajas are anxiously expecting the Peshwa�s arrival, a momentous change appears to be in sight.�

The question of creating a Hindu Empire took firm hold. The Rana of Udaypur was fully prepared now for this proposal, when Bajirao had undertaken to stand behind it. The Rana sent Gumansing (62) to Sawai Jaysing, who told him that Raya wished to place Ranaji on the throne of Delhi. Ranaji had told that all his wealth (for this purpose) belonged to Raya and that Raya and Sawaiji were his men of trust. Gokulchand was sent to Abhaysing and Bundelas were expected to join the union. Thus by the end of May1739 A.D., the Rajput Chief�s prepared themselves for the drastic change and were eagerly expecting Bajirao�s arrival in the North.

� � � � � �  Bajirao was at Burhanpur (63) at the time of the sack of Delhi, by Nadirshah. About the question of creating a Hindu monarchy at Delhi, Shahu informed him his sentiments in a letter dated 31st May 1739 A.D. The letter reads (64) ,

�that it should be our duty to resuscitate the falling Mughal Empire, that the Chhatrapati, as you are already aware, does not aspire to secure the imperial position for himself, that he considers it a higher merit to renovate an old dilapidated edifice than to build a new one. If we attempt the other course (i.e. a Hindu monarchy) it would involve us in enmity with all our neighbors with the consequence that we would be exposed to unnecessary dangers and court a crop of trouble all round.�

Shahu was moderate in his aims and desired to secure only the administrative management for the Marathas in the capacity of the Amir-ul-Umara of the Mughal Empire. It was his desire that by supporting whole-heartedly Muhammad Shah�s regime, they should collect the revenue of the Country and after recovery of the expanses for the troops, should pay the balance into the Imperial treasury.

But even though the Peshwa complied finally with the commands of the Chhatrapati, he was really much more ambitious and definitely a Hindu State was in his mind (65).

(57) ‘Itihasa Sangraha’ – Letters of Dhondo Govind.
(58) ‘Satara Hist. Papers’ Vol. II, 270.
(59) S.P.D. 15-75, ‘Purandare Daftar’ III – 183. M.I.S. Vol. II, p. 133, 134, ‘Satara Hist. Papers’ Vol. II-266.
(60) S.P.D. 15-72.
(61) ‘Itihasa Sangrah, Aitihasik Charitra’ – 4, ‘New Hist.’ Vol. II, p. 178, 179.
(62) ‘Itihasa Sangrah – Aitihasik Charitra’ – 7.
(63) ‘Brahmendra Swami Charitra’ – p. 118, S.P.D. 15-72, 75, S.P.D. 30-229 M.I.S. Vol. VI, – 133, 134..
(64) ‘Satara Hist.Papers’ Vol II-268, ‘New Hist.’ Vol. II, p. 180.
For the present Tohmast Kuli (Nadirshah) has won the fight. But if all the Hindus take to courage (and unite) and if our greaty armies reach North (it is a lime) for the Hindu Empire to come into existence. ” ‘Brahmendra Swami Charitra’, p. 118.

Request school data from India parents.

Please help and answer the following 10 quick questions: http://goo.gl/forms/af8GanzEvg
In USA, public schools are quite good (at least as good as one can expect those usually life-sucking worker-making factories to be). But I know nothing about India of today.

If we live in India, I definitely want the kids (if they don’t homeschool under my able tutelage :-) ) to receive good education – one which is preferably NOT English medium (Hindi/ Telugu/ Marathi/ blah blah – any Hindu language is good). And I don’t want to remain a “coolie” and sacrifice all of my life to money-grubbing just so my kids attend some ridiculous “international” school.

THE vIra-rasa-kAvya of today

I thought reading shivarAjyodayam, by shrIdhara-bhAskara of the varNekar-s, (I have a hard copy) will put me back to sleep, but boy, how wrong I was. The reason I picked this book was to hope against hope that it would provide some hope for a solid future for hindu-s, despite our population being moron-heavy – after all, shivAji’s time was filled with even worse uncertainty, with similar problems arising from collaborators, foreign powers and native slumber. The work is high in poetic quality – I have recently adapted a habit of marking high quality verses with scores (1-5), and there were a lot of 5-s.

But beyond mere ornamentation, it exuded such vIra-rasa like warm blood from a punctured enemy chest. I’ve read large portions of raghuvaMsha, kumArasambhava, etc.., but I feel that I experienced true rasa-kAvya today. Perhaps it says as much about me (and perhaps my clan) as the works themselves, but I recall only few other cases that moved me as much (subject to defects of memory, of course): the initial sarga-s of sundarakANDa, rati’s lament and pArvati’s rebuff to shiva in disguise in kumArasambhava, sItA-parityAga in uttarakANDa. As my feeling rose to a crescendo in response to the climax of the first sarga, I felt quite ready to drink the blood of a few meccan demons, or at least, check out bAjIrAv mastAni.

Bajirao Mastani Poster 2.jpg

This is an ideal work to present to children of sanskrit-speaking families. kAlidAsa can wait. But what one can do now is far from clear. One can emulate the patriot bAlagangAdhara tiLak in his inspiring writings in the kesarI (but towards the end, even he was broken), or one can do some rash and stupid thing like the chApekar brothers or …. Can one be a subhASha-candra, who with all his defects, felled the barbarian empire, or better yet – can one be shivAji (this time, also thoroughly dealing with the heart of the problem as well)?

Digesting Santa Claus

Santa Claus is a merry character. He grips the minds of children, and the hearts of all sahRdaya-s with his cheer and compassion. Whatever his pagan origins might have been (ibtimes), we pagans have a problem: He is intimately connected with the zombie cult. Indeed the zombie bastard child is said to have burdened the earth on the santa claus day.

Luckily, we hindu-s have had long experience with borrowing and hijacking of our deities as part of the competition amongst our orthodox and heterodox traditions. All one needs is “expand” a few legends. So, lets “understand” santa claus in our terms.

Santa Claus is Kubera, the vaishravaNa.

It makes great sense, as you’ll see:

  • Santa Claus is rich. kubera is rich.
  • Santa Claus is fat. kubera is fat.
  • Santa Claus lives in the wintery north, not too far from Alaska. kubera lives in the wintery north, right in alakA.
  • Santa Claus is assisted by elves. kubera is assisted by yakShas. (He is afterall lord of yakSha-s, Guhyakas, Kinnaras and Gandharvas.)
  • Santa Claus is close buddy of the supreme deity. kubera is a close buddy of indra and shiva.
  • Santa Claus has a flying sled. kubera has the puShpaka vimAna.

Now for the “expansion”. The mlecCha-s, when they were infected by the zombie’s disease, somehow managed to hold on to a few pagan deities, who of course, became angels and saints in their mouse-like perspective. They remembered only small aspects of the old deities. kubera, it turns out, was remembered as Santa Claus. Adored during the earlier festival of yakSha-rAtri (aka dIpAvalI), and having prepared for it all year with the assistance of the yakSha-s, he tours the worlds every year to gift good hearted people -especially children and the needy. On this occasion, he swaps his equine mount for a flying chariot drawn by reindeer.

His mantra-s are: ॐ वैश्रवणाय स्वाहा! All kids who chant it with great attention and vivid visualization will get superb gifts! All adults who become agents of kubera in distributing wealth to young hearts will earn great puNya. Furthermore, the infected mind who attains true siddhi of vaishravaNa may even escape the zombie’s curse.

So, happy kuberotsava to hindu-s and happy santa claus day to the mlecCha-s!

A book to take to the desert island.

A commonplace question is: “If you could take one book with you as you are marooned on a desert island, what would it be?”. Assuming that my bodily needs were adequately taken care of, my current answer is clear. It is not rAmAyaNa or mahAbhArata or kathAsaritsAgara or raghuvaMsha or kumArasambhava or (horrors) the bhAgavata purANa.

It is subhAShita-ratna-bhANDAgara. If I can take only one chapter, it would be the initial mangalAcaraNa-prakaraNam. Such exquisite beauty! With each shloka one can loose oneself in a wonderful universe. What to say of thousands of them? A sample pertaining to our great clansman:

Rabid dog barks at the elephant

Little gajAsya has been listening to his father with great devotion and enthusiasm. At his behest, he has devoured the nItishAstra-s of viShNusharman and nArAyaNa-bhaTTa in the winter holidays. Now the precocious lad had begun to study the contemporaneous works his father has compiled for him. In particular, he loves the works of the great sage of mAnasatarangiNI. Its metaphorical thinking, the sanskrit inspired verbiage and the stunningly clear thought naturally grip his mind like the svara-s and rahasya-s of a well conceived mantra. After a long night under the stars, hearkening to his father discussing the struggle in the homeland with the wise vajrins visiting from afar, he retires to sleep.

The matriarch’s tale

Curiously, the great simian he invoked before dozing off has turned him into an elephant. The matriarch’s soothing rumbling somehow is now identifiable as samskrta.


He invokes the terrible horse headed protector of wisdom as well as the lady who yet flows strongly through the mouths of wise pashus; and settles down to listen:


The gentle animals roam the forests happily and develop high cultures. Until one day, when rabies (strain C) begins to spread among some animals. Rabid dogs bite the wolves and the virus jumps many species. These infected animals, frothing at the mouth, then begin to terrorize the relatively gentler animals with their holy wars. Or at least an unbearably significant fraction of them do, while the rest watch. No animal not showing signs of infection is spared. Several formidable continents completely fall to various strains of the virus, so that there is almost no uninfected animal left. Rare flashes of resistance like julian the mammoth and plethon the lion show up, but the rabid animals finish them off.


The jambu island too gets hit a millennium after the first major outbreak (strain I). For a long time, the animals have no idea what has hit them. They do not understand why these crazy obnoxious wolves are so keen to bite them. Are they just stupid barbarians? Do they have some sort of a disease? The elephants put up a mighty resistance. After several centuries, they begin to contain the infection.

Just as they are beginning to comprehend the root of the problem, and before they are able to even consider reversing the contagion, the sacred island gets hit by yet another strain of the virus (strain S)- this time carried by a band of red coated foxes. They are very patient, much unlike the previous lupine invasion. After strategic encirclement and successful exploitation of the divisions within the denizens of jambu, they come to rule.


Within the newer invaders, the virus has mutated, thanks to competition with the retrovirus sprung by Plethon the lion before his death in the island of the yavana-s. The virus is, as a result, milder in the foxes. Still, it is very far indeed from loosing its contagious power. It remarkably infects other animals at a slow but deadly pace, so that it takes a few generations for an animal to succumb fully to it. Such an animal acts very strangely. It still froths at the mouth and continually bothers uninfected animals (whom it calls primitive and superstitious). But, rather than biting them at once, it just insists that the more deadly strains should be allowed to spread without any hinderance. It calls those that resist such a proposal intolerant fascist unsecular scum. This milder strain of the virus is perfectly content to compete for supremacy in a population completely infected by itself (strain S) or its earlier relatives(strains C or I). As such, strains C, I and S present a fairly united front as far as the uninfected are concerned (if they exist, that is).


In the meantime, in the islands of the uShAputra-s, the wise macaques faced an invasion by leopards infected by a particularly virulent form of strain C. However, they had several advantages over their spiritual cousins, the wise elephants of jambu island, in facing this invasion: they were more united politically, far more homogenous (so that the rabid leopard clearly stood out as an alien) and, as a younger culture, more willing to learn the motivations of the feline berserkers. The leadership of their well structured society responded ruthlessly and ferociously. No leopard was left alive in their lands, every leopard half-breed was exiled, and the local infected population was either killed off or meticulously decontaminated. They then shut down their islands to keep the contagions out. Eventually, rabid eagles (with strain S) from the ramaNaka island forced them to drop isolation. The wise macaques reacted swiftly and modernized their sticks and stones. As vigilant as ever to guard their uninfected forest, they began a steady program of pushing back the power of the infected barbarians from the far eastern reaches of the nearby jambu island, inflicting stunning losses on their foes.

Ultimately, however, the power of the forces infected by strains C and S was just too much, and after heavy losses, they admitted defeat. But, they had accomplished something remarkable. So much of the infected forces’ power was spent fighting them, and such was the rebellion they inspired in uninfected populations of jambu island that the forces of strains C and S were forced to withdraw. By sacrificing a great deal of blood, the macaques had not only saved their holy groves, they had also helped their spiritual cousins. The forests of the elephants was nominally freed – but alas, huge populations were infected by strains I, S and C. Much as the weakened elephants tried, these strains were gaining the upper hand in their groves, and there was no sign of respite.

The matriarch then looked directly at gajAsya and said: “Young calf, this is the situation you are faced with. Understand and be afraid. Study the past closely as well as the nIti basics and the tantras of the thunderbolts. It is up to you to carry on the long fight for freedom. It is not right that we should flicker out in this pitiful dishonorable manner. The divine beings made us better than that! They await us in the stars.” She fell silent.


gajAsya quitely paid obeisence, and walked away in melancholy. He invoked the thunderbolt weilding elephant rider who guides animals to victory and grinds opponents to dust as he sought to calm his rage and contemplated strategy. Out of nowhere, a rabid dog appeared and started barking viciously at him and started slandering the whole elephantine species. Observing it carefully, gajAsya recognized strain S. Like ekalavya of the great epic, he responded (for the benefit of the innocent spectating deer) with a few carefully placed word-arrows. The dog however, continued to bark. Just as he was about to respond …

He woke up. The fingers of the million-ray-ed fire in the sky had entered his body through his eyes and was tugging at his heart. He made fast to join his father and his friends in paying obeisance to the solar life giver: “May that unblemished brightness of Sol cleanse us!”



prabuddhi, gajAsya’s anglophone cousin, came across this curious report in his diary. Though she was 4 years older, she could not understand half of what he said – the references were obscure, and even the English words were unusual (let alone the sanskrit ones). For example, she did not quite understand what I, S and C stand for in the strain names, or what the islands of jambu, yavana-s, ramaNaka and uShAputra-s were. Her curiosity was piqued though – she was sure there was more to this story. She knew there was no use asking him or his dad – they liked to speak in riddles and metaphors from the ocean of pagan lore. Furthermore, she was too proud to come across like her middle aged aunt who would cause endless amusement by rolling her squint eyes when hit senseless by ideas in sentences longer than 10 words. She resolved to work it out herself, with the help of internet. Plethon and Julian – these she could look up. Could these events somehow relate to events in the world history? Could the islands correspond to places? The strains – could some of them correspond to major memetic viruses that gajAsya’s dad spoke about? She contemplated all this as she sat across from the statue of the awakened one in solitude.



Cordyceps fungi attacking ants, and ants fighting back – here.

A hindu state vs a secular state.

What’s a hindu state?

A Hindu state might have the following (besides what one normally expects of a functioning government)

  • state rituals,
  • potentially organized quarantine and disinfection of people in the grips of the intolerant Abrahamist mental afflictions.

A secular state (in the sense of the Leukospheric states such as 21st century USA or France, rather than the Abrahamophilic Indian state or 19th century USA) is obviously inferior to such a Hindu state (from our point of view, of course).

That said, how much worse is a truly secular state?

  • Obviously, the Abrahamistic diseases will be allowed to spread quite freely.
  • Worse, it may pursue the detriment of hindus and pagans as a matter of foreign policy.
  • But at least conscious, stubborn, conservative (yet modern) Hindus who study and practice the ways of their ancestors will be free to practice and propagate their superior ways of self cultivation and social harmony (minus the important governmental aspect, of course).
    • In any case, the number of idiots in any society is despairingly large. The modern orthodox hindu elite can keep to their practices, which would hypothetically grant them a clear edge in the pursuit of material and sentimental happiness.
    • The modern hindu orthodoxy can bide their time in this stasis mode for ages, until the day they get an opportunity to help their less fortunate fellow men, women and shemen attain a state free of the vexing Abraham disease.
  • At least it will be much better than even the moderate non-secular Islamic/ Christian/ Jewsish states!
    • FYI – as a poignant example – even Bali and Indonesian hindus in general are in jeopardy. There are oppressive laws curtailing construction of temples.

Why this analysis?

This sort of comparison is critical given the facts that:

  • most Hindus in the dumbocratic Islamophilic republic of India do not care to strive for a Hindu state.
  • In most other countries, barring Nepal, there is currently nearly zero chance of Hindu rule.
  • Certain hindus are faced with the choice of how they might facilitate the choice of country by their proximal and distant progeny.

We have omitted some important factors are not considered, though, such as:

  • The moral imperative to fight the good fight for the Hindu state – until the last possible moment when it is absolutely clear that hope is lost.
  • The attractiveness of some non-hindu pagan states which have awakened to the dangerous abrahamic contagion (eg – Bhutan, Burma).

As usual, intelligent feedback is most welcome.

South Asianists strike again : CA textbook 2015.

Please note “Hindu religion studies Faculty Review of Proposed California Curriculum Framework“​ (pdf).

It’s apparent to those involved in the hearings closely that FACULTY statements have a MUCH higher weight in the eyes of the Framework committee than us “public”. We need a “Hindu religion studies Faculty Review of Proposed California Curriculum Framework“​ to present our side.

Upon reading their production, I finally understand the words of the sage of MT, who had noted that every person who uses the words “South Asian” instead of “Hindu” or “India” is an enemy of “Hindus”. More explanation of that here.

Cow protection in other cultures

Following info I gained from a FB conversation.

  • “The Zoroastrian religion forbids cow flesh for consumption. The cow also figures symbolically in several aspects of that religion, and cow urine is drunk at the Navjote sacrament. It is another matter that Westernized Anglophile Parsis have ignored the dietary laws among many other things. … even until recently, cows were not a part of regular diet in Iran. It was during Westernization under the Qajar dynasty that the Brits & French introduced beef eating big time (which is now widespread in Iran). That shift was a traumatic cultural change, especially in the countryside. Watch the Persian movie “Gaav” (Cow) [YT1], which depicts the attachment an Irani peasant has for his cow, and how the new beef industry sponsored cattle mafia snatch his kine from him, causing him to have a nervous breakdown. Khomeini, who was initially against film as a medium was convinced to allow the film industry to continue to operate after he watched that movie.” [AG12]
  • Pakistan has banned female animal slaughter since 1963 – reinvigorated even in 2015 – DA15.
  • Among the masai, cattle is slaughtered only in times of great need (eg – famine). [MAL]
  • Japan
    • Emperor Shomu (8th ce) had banned cow and horse slaughter. This was one of the justifications used by Toyotomi Hideyoshi to expel Jesuits. For centuries, it was taboo in Japan to kill cows (and more broadly other domestic animals) – wild game was allowed. [B]
    • “Tsunayoshi’s “Laws of Compassion” are most closely associated with the protection of dogs, but as Tsukamoto points out, the laws he enacted regarding the abandonment of sick cattle and horses were, in fact, both stricter and further reaching.” [B]
    • Yet, almost as soon as the new “treaty port” of Kobe was opened to Western settlement in 1868, it began to develop a reputation for its meat. The Tokugawa continued this ban. [B]

Tension between subverting and being subverted – a khAlistani lesson

Funny anecdotes via pratiika​ about khAlistAni nuts during the modi visit-
1. Outside FaceBook the sardarji-s face off with hindus. They keep shouting anti-modi slogans. The hindus initially respond with the likes of “bhaarat maata ki jai”. Then, some hindu has a brilliant idea – the hindus start shouting “jo bole so nihaal – sat sri akaal”. The turbans are stumped.

2. Outside Google, the sardaarji face off with hindus. This time they get physical and push. Unlucky for them, the hindus include rather well built haryANvi boxer types, who coolly respond by saying: “chal maar- guru gobind singh ke naam pe maar”.

Both of these illustrates an potential positive, as well as a potential negative.

  1. The positive is the prospect of taking over the inimical ideology (remember that sikhism is proto-islamophile-sickularism) by claiming that we know their philosophy and history better than they do.
    1. If the opposing community is relatively tiny, this may well work.
      1. Could sikhism be a potential example? Could our hindu friends, who as a whole are unparalleled experts at fooling themselves, may have done the right thing for the wrong reason?
    2. If by contrast, the enemy is large enough to control its own narrative, this wont work.
      1. Islam is a clear example.
  2. The negative is the enormous disastrous consequences of fooling oneself into tolerating an enemy and letting them prosper, or worse – taking them for friends.

Related discussions – FB.

Hindus in Trinidad – a repeat of Fiji?


The following is from a conversation among friends.

37.6% are Indian origin in Trinidad.

“According to the 2011 Census, 33.4% of the population was Protestant (including 12.0% Pentecostal, 5.7% Anglican, 4.1% Seventh-day Adventist, 3.0% Presbyterian or Congregational, 1.2% Baptist, and .1% Methodist), 21.5% was Roman Catholic, 18.1% was Hindu, and 5.0% was Muslim. A small number of individuals subscribed to traditional Caribbean religions with African roots, such as the Spiritual Baptists (sometimes called Shouter Baptists) (5.7%); and the Orisha (0.1%). ”

so just 23% pagan.

This island is so mixed up sometimes its hard to tell what some one practices
You would find Muslims who would be by a Christian home for xmas drinking rum and eating pork

Indian marginalization and racial tension.

Indian were marginalized for years since they came here brought by the British but also by the Descendants of slave like myself ….The change came with the Independence transition in the 50’s we got our first local government made up of Africans. Making it hard for them since they could not speak standard English well….and could not get into the public sector….But they built their own school with help from the Canadian churches converting some of course. They excelled ….So while the back became dependent on the state the Indians became self sufficient .In the 90’s we got our first Hindu Indian PM and every truely open for them now….They have a heavy presence in the Public sector now. Police Army etc…..

***while the blacks became dependent****

The only reason racial tension dont really get out of controlled here is because there is enough wealth to go around compared to other placed where Indian settled in the Caribbean…Oil and gas put us above average….

My take is the Indian came here already prejudice because of their ideas of caste etc and the African who having no one else to blame for any issue when the British left blame the Indians…Both are at fault for the silliness but in essence came here on the same boat to work and things could work once their is mutual respect and understanding of our past

Hindu Army participation

(Question) So, do hindu Indians form say 30% of the army atleast? the reason we wonder is because hindus have been stupid enough to neglect this important role in other lands (eg: fiji), with disastrous consequences.
no not really but the discrimination is as blatant as before ….Once a Minister was fired for highlighting a reporting stating Indians were marginalize in the Police service … The race card was pulled so to speak and he was sent home. The PM who sent him home was a Hindu Indian which I found silly because he was stating facts.
The only time I have seen many Indian in the Police service within my 3 odd decades on this planet is when We got our first Indian PM
And my father was a Police officer so I know how those systems operate
In the report it state a lot of Indian were more than qualified to join but were put aside for Africans
In school even as a adult and i think back all my Indian friend generally their parent were self employed mostly in farming , merchants that sort of thing and all the Africans had government jobs

It also fed straight into the culture so Indian are now doctors lawyers accounts engineers multimillion dollar businessmen and the African despise them because they didn’t take education seriously because they were in control more a number of years

(Question:) So, the Indians do try (a bit), but are discriminated against. Indians are making the same mistake they made in Kenya and Fiji then.

hmmmm interesting

The rAmacharitamAnasa brAhmaNa mahA sabhA

(A favorable view from Hinduism Today. Comments – The Sat Maharaj he is the head of the sabhaa A very Racist individual. Umesh now is a belong to another sect )

sometime I think Indians suffer from a identity crisis like blacks
what’s this crisis like?
example their is a huge sabha that controls most of the hindu here they say they alone can be brahmin priest and they are descendants of that caste in India
my thing is which bunch of Brahmins would leave India to come here and cut sugar cane
that puzzle me
i see.
they have last name like maharaj mahabhir etc

(Question) so, do other hindu trinidadians resent this?
yes because it excludes a lot of them from being priests and doing ritual for ppl
(Question) what fraction are they? (of hindus there) do they still keep the samskAra-s (like upanayana)? And are they well educated in sanskrit?
only Brahmin Priest of the line cane do upanayana
Sanskrit is dead to them
I have tried my best to get them to learn it
but I am tried of begging them

i mean is 1 in every 3 hindu trinidadian a member of this sabha?
well no but its the biggest hindu sect on the island
yea in some sense yes

They read mostly the Tulsi das ramchitamanas

local priest tell the myths story and teach them as being literal. I think its another reason hindus convert

Role (or rather, the lack) of sanskrit

(Question) do they tend know a lot of mantra-s (if they’re in the ritual business, that is)?
Every thing is generally done by guess in my opinion
and that observation is based on the little sanskrit i know

(Question) what’s it like in nearby nations like guyana? are race tensions higher there?
not really

(Question) also spoken sanskrit movement is active in trinidad?
only me and hand full of ppl know any sanskrit at all
how did you come to learn it?
I want to get a Samskrit bhaarati centre here

(Question) why dont you start one? (I’m serious)
Me learning sanskrit is more of a far fetched spiritual journey that would lead to another discourse but i didnt ant to know all the spoken sanskrit and grammar just want to learn vedic chanting but since I know how complicated it is I settle for classical sanskrit ……but that what I am working on now with my teachers and the Bangalore branch
We trying to establish a centre here for sanskrit studies and Indian philosophy

(Additional note: They would usually dump Sanskrit for Hindi as singing songs in that language is more popular than chanting Mantras.)

(Question) vey cool! are you an afro?

(Question) are there many afro hindus?
no very few

SS: most came from UP, hence the popularity of ramcharitmanas which was/is the popular text. a few came from tamilnadu to trinidad.

In Martinique most Indians came from tamilnadu and other southern states.

In Suriname, Guyana, and Trinidad from UP area.

Its another reason Sanskrit is not important they have no need for it in the way they practice. Very much like fijians, who barely need it

SS:most samskrita knowledge and practice was lost anyway in the north under the heavy muslim pressure and destruction of centers of learning, in part the development of bhakti was a response to these circumstances where in ramayana was taken to the masses through vernacular awadhi by tulasidas.

yeah. and many brahmins in that area had taken up agriculture, even army service. not suprising many of them would have found their way to trinidad.
desperate times.

I called the Hinduism here creole hindus.

SS: i was reading some early indentured accounts, they say the ramcharitmanas was the only thing that kept them going after the back breaking labor and being in a strange land (sometimes the brits lied to the laborers they recruited on where they were going). The early Brahmins used to make them sing the ramcharitmanas as it was already known to them so that they wouldn’t forget.

That is very true
they know the text very well
it kept them sane


Mixed race

(Question) i see that 14% are mixed race – they’re mostly afro+indian right?
the mix are mostly indian and african
we call them douglas
(Question) And mostly non-hindus, right?
I have not a clue why douglas but with the mention of the word we know it is indian mix with african
i see.
most douglas are not hindus
hindus easily convert its because there is not a solid base of Indian culture here

Hindu and pagan afros, and sabhA antipathy
(Question) Was http://www.chakranews.com/hindu-temple-in-trinidad-vandalized-with-human-waste-and-its-deities-destroyed-again/5040 big news?
i see.
yes that happens at times
you heard of Jack Warner???
He is a Fifa offical
African Hindu
if he is not a hindu no one does yajnas more than him lol

he was at a temple one time and they almost burnt it down the following day

(Question) wow! when was this? in that case it was indians doing it non-hindu indians?
I have been met with abuse for learning sanskrit
no hindu indians

(Question) weird – why would they burn a temple? and why’ve you been met with abuse for learning sanskrit?
because a african was inside of it

(Question) wow. how stupid. not knowing friends, not knowing enemies. sign of a doomed people.

The monopoly of the temples by the hindu sabhaa is a big money making enterprise
I was told dont learn sanskrit to do rituals. they oppose knowledge for hindus

(Question) the temple which was burnt down was not affiliated with the sabhA?
i see.

(Question) i sort of understand why the sabhA people would burn down a temple they don’t control (destroying competition). But why specially target a temple patronized by afro-s?
They dont really like Africans
I am not allowed to join
yeah – but it’s not even their temple.
my upanayana was done in secret

(Question) roughly what fraction of temples are non-sabhA?
25%or so

(Question) are there other forms of paganism amongst the africans there? is hinduism the most popular among them?
we have orisa
orissa is a west african practice
we have the baptiste they do hindu ritual at times

they are mostly african that would worship shiva and hanuman mostly

They say shiva is a rasta man lol they got that heavy influence from Indian that came here
but they would not admit it. Africans did not bring ganja here the indians did

(Question) would you consider them pagan? (ie are they into the “true religion” vs “false religion” , true god vs false god business?)

They are just a bunch of pot heads looking for something
lost African trying to look for their ownselves
I pity them at times

SS: rastas r abrahamic, they worship Haile Selassie I, emperor of Ethiopia. They have some weird beliefs.
Orisa is west african, according to that ganga teerath pilgrimage article goddess Oshun is identified by them with Ganga, both of them having yellow as their color.
that is them

The madrasi-orisa sympathy
most Indian i was told came from utterpradesh right
but there were some came from Tamil nadu
and Tamil indians are called madras
dont know why but other hindu sect dont like to associate with them
but the mix well with the africans
they also mix with with the orissa

(Question) why don’t they like the madrasis?
because both still do animal sacrifice
So kali and shiva is respected amounfg the baptiste and orissa.

(Additional note: The Kali bhaktas here who do Sacrifice now somewhat do it in hiding because of the scorn shame disgust they are met with by the so called Ahimsa conventional Hindus. Now some temples have converted to do no sacrifice because of this.In the Temples that still do it Goats chickens and for a special type of ritual Pigs/hogs are sacrificed. I personally don’t have anything against Animal sacrifice because the practice is old ancient and pervaded all major cultural groups on the planet and its where Hinduism originated from. Some Hindus don’t really know what the coconut represents or what it replaced and I often have to tell people Shiva’s Trident is not a Agricultural tool for farming.)

(Question) so madrasis mix well with orisa
yea; Is like same force different form

(Question) good. they’re not in the sabhA i suppose.
no they keep to themselves
the sabhaa hate them
due to the animal slaughter
SS: does trinidad have any taino native people?
they were two sect arawaks and caribs
the first were the peaceful type and they died off the their still are caribs arounds
SS:i see thx

Link language question: Hebrew revival and Sanskrit revival.

The below note is by a friend.

In terms of what we could learn from the Jews, the revival of Hebrew is very important:


India had a unique ecosystem that supported *genuine* diversity. This is best seen in its linguistic ecosystem, with a two-level Sanskrit-Prakrit division, each one nourishing the other. I compare it to the water cycle – where the rivers, seas and marshes all contribute to the crystallization of clouds, and the clouds in turn dispense distilled water onto all of these again.

But today that ecosystem has been broken. And there is a false dichotomy and a vicious politics between the “logical” and “sentimental” types that will never allow Sanskrit to rise and rehabilitate that ecosystem…which in turn means that all Indian languages will fall to ugly, “haphazard Anglicization” rather than “systematic Sanskritization”.

This false politics that thrives on the tension between a “logical” and “sentimental” dipole (which the Congress has been playing), can be broken only by policy that is shoved past these voices – either by sleight of hand or by brute force. That is my takeaway from how it happened with Hebrew:

1. In the mid-1800’s, a small number of weird, impractical and nerdy Jews started a “spoken Hebrew” movement, just like Samskrita Bharati. They started using Hebrew for regular, secular subjects rather than only religious incantations. Short stories and novels in Hebrew were published.

2. But that was not enough – only a few Jews were intellectually inclined to take up this “hobby”, and most of them made “logical” arguments about how in this modern age we should all learn German/English/Russian etc (depending on where they were living). Of course, the same intellectually lazy, “logical” and “practical” members of Jewish society also paid customary tributes to Hebrew as a repository of their ancient culture and identity, but no doubt pointed out that it was wise to be “practical” and accept the reality of the domination of European languages in modern times…

When some Jews from various countries migrated to the Palestinian Mandate under British rule, they needed to have a link language. The towering “logical” types as well as the well-grounded “sentimental” Jews suggested Yiddish, since that was the language of a majority of Ashkenazi Jews, like Hindi in India. But Jews from other parts objected – because they were equally “sentimental” about their mother-tongues. Then some “logical” types suggested English, given the “reality” of the post WW-2 “world”.

But unfortunately or fortunately, Israel was founded by those “impractical” “nerdy” types whose thought currents were not rooted in the same Reality as the “logical” types. So they made it the law that Hebrew and no other language would be the link language for multilingual Israel.

Thus, a gradual “spoken Hebrew movement” created a small but critical mass of intellects who saw what was possible. Then this small class made a POLICY decision to goad the rest of the lazy / logical / practical types to learn the bloody language.

Thus, in India also, we will see the “logical” Indian urging us to just learn English and keep our mother-tongues for popular culture, and we will see the “sentimental” Indians urging us to “protect” their mother-tongues from, both, English as well as one another (Tamil versus Hindi, etc). Sanskrit will have to navigate this political space deftly, by appealing to, both, the logical and sentimental, and tricking them both!